Studio - General Forum

Re: Betreft: Re: poor quality menus

Ayem — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 11:20:39 GMT

Hi, I'm new here. A couple of days ago I downloaded a trial of S14. I have a need for an easy method of producing DVD menus for slide shows that I make and S14 seemed to fit the bill.

But while the menu system is very easy, the quality of the menus when the disk is displayed is awful. I might add here that I am producing Blu-Ray disks and showing them on a 50inch Pana full HDTV.

I found that if I produced just an MPG file then the Menu quality was fine but of course you can't actually use the menu in this way. But when I produced a Blu-Ray disk then the Menu file which appears to be 00100.M2ts in the Stream dir then the quality is dire.

It didn't matter what stock menu I used or if I used my own background picture which was a 1920x1080 jpg (so should have been fine).

Fortunately I came across your forum and this thread as I was about to dump the Program.

The work around of a transparent Menu background with the actual menu picture on the overlay track works fine - its just a nuisance to do it that way

I am surprised though that Pinnacle can't solve this seemingly small but critical problem.

Now of course I have the dilemma of whether to buy the prog and hope there are no other traps laying in wait or go back to Sony DVD Architect or CyberDirector which aren't ideal either

AYEM

Betreft: Re: poor quality menus

Marcus 3 — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 09:03:35 GMT

I just got Pinnacle Studio 14 for anyone else tested, because I do not work with Studio 14 (No SmartSound).

Here in Europe (PAL) the results of Menu, Picto's or Icons, Backgrounds and Pictures or Photo's and Text are in order and the problem is gone!

Why is there still no Pinnacle Studio 12 Update Patch for the customers?

Marc

Re: poor quality menus

patndave — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 03:14:11 GMT

glus:

The problem as reported in the opening post here, was reproduced here in QA during the S14 test cycle. Fixes were made, and menu quality is much improved in Studio 14 - menu background image and menu text is sharper, the fuzziness problem is improved overall (we also used S9 quality as the benchmark). Unfortunately this doesn't help you folks using S12, so I can only apologize about that, because another patch for S12 is unlikely. For those of you willing to move to, or already using S14, I think you'll find that the quality there is on par with S9.

Thanks - sorry I waited so long to reply.

Looking at the screen captures that you posted today, I would have a hard time justifying that the menu quality is "much" improved in Studio 14.

The S14 results are a heck of a lot closer to the poor quality of the S12 results than to the good quality of the S9 results. I would not consider the S14 changes to be a "fix". The problem still exists. It may be "better" but it is still "poor".

Re: poor quality menus

justaviking — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 01:41:30 GMT

glus:

Here's what we did in the comparison tests:

In our comparison we observed that S9 had good clarity, especially on text, but had some color problem; S12 had closer color, but poor resolution and fuzzy text; S14 had better resolution and improved text quality.

Glus,

WHEN was this test done? We've been complaining and complaining. This test should have been done when S10 was released, and it should have been fixed in the S10.1 patch. Then we wouldn't be talking about it all through the life of S10... and S11.... and S12.... and only now getting acknowledged in S14.

I think in S12 there were some weak claims of improvement, but only in HiDef projects.

Currently we are suffering some various issues with S14, such as "Import" issues. You can't blame us for cynically wondering when THEY will be fixed. S27???

Sorry, I don't like to shoot the messenger. But this has been a major annoyance of mine for a loooooong time, and the only workaround was to not use Studio, and I needed to vent (again).

Betreft: Re: poor quality menus

Marcus 3 — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 00:13:58 GMT

OK.

Pinnacle says: "Studio 12 has poor resolution (Menu's and Picto's and Photo's and Backgrounds) and fuzzy text",

Why is there no update for your Studio 12 customers?

Marc

Re: poor quality menus

glus — Fri, 20 Nov 2009 23:04:43 GMT

Here's what we did in the comparison tests:

-DV clip on TL

"From the Board Room" menu, one chapter point.

-Use Menu Editor to select a Jpeg file as background (10MP image if I recall).

-Export to DVD, played in software player and took a screenshot.

In our comparison we observed that S9 had good clarity, especially on text, but had some color problem; S12 had closer color, but poor resolution and fuzzy text; S14 had better resolution and improved text quality.

Re: poor quality menus

nthdgreee — Thu, 19 Nov 2009 00:08:46 GMT

NO WAY!

Aw man, if that's true, there is absolutely no reason whatsoever to spend any more money on another upgrade in Studio. I've been using this product for so long and have had such a love hate relationship with it over the years the it will be somewhat difficult to transition out of the product. I guess it's time to move on.

I did download the trial in order to check out the menus but I guess there's no need to load it up now. Thanks for the input andyonair. Is there anyone else who can confirm that this issue still exists?

I'm not going to ask for other product recommendations here since I wouldn't feel right doing that on the Pinnacle site.....so I guess it's time for my research to begin.

I'll continue to watch the boards in the event some new information comes up.

Re: poor quality menus

andyonair — Wed, 18 Nov 2009 22:18:55 GMT

fidel47:
Are menus in Studio 14 really much better looking than on Studio 10 , 11 or 12?

No I have have just bought Pinnacle 14 in the hope this problem has been fixed. IT HAS NOT !

The menus in 14 are horrendous. Quality is terrible. I think it is a disgrace that that this issue has still not been fixed.

Studio 9 was the only version that offered good quality menus.

The menu is the first thing you see on a dvd and when presented what looks like something make in 1960 quality what i joke

Sorry pinnacle whilst i like the general layout and ease of the program, this is the last straw.

Re: poor quality menus

fidel47 — Mon, 16 Nov 2009 20:57:55 GMT

Are menus in Studio 14 really much better looking than on Studio 10 , 11 or 12?

Re: poor quality menus

bsn321 — Mon, 16 Nov 2009 20:31:28 GMT

Okay - but wait a second:

Here is option b) for workaround on poor menu quality:

b) By giving your menu a transparent background and putting your actual background still-image file on the video overlay track "in front of" the menu

Is this saying that by using this workaround, we cannot use the stock menus? That is - I'm using a stock menu I found in the menu list that came with S12 Plus. Using this workaround method, how does one use the image that is in the stock menu as the background, even if in the video overlay? In other words, using the terminology of the workaround listed above, what if the "actual background still-image file" is the image in the stock menu itself???

ALSO - it would appear that option a) entails the use of some sort of video in the menu, which apparently alleviates poor quality. Is it possible to just have a thumbnail video of nothing? Or, if a black background is used, a video of nothing but black?

Re: poor quality menus

bsn321 — Mon, 16 Nov 2009 20:21:26 GMT

Thanks nthdgree - for posting link to the workarounds. I missed those.

Still - I'm in disbelief there is no fix for this.

I will try the workaround - seems like option 2 is the most popular. I really hope it works and I can salvage my excitement for making DVDs for the family!

Many thanks -

Re: poor quality menus

nthdgreee — Mon, 16 Nov 2009 19:48:48 GMT

I know your frustration. Here I am still not upgrading to Studio 14 because I've finally got my system working pretty consistently. Yes, the fuzzy menu still exists, and the workarounds must be invoked in order to get a menu that's somewhat decent (still no where near the quality of Studio 9 menus).

I did download the trial edition of Studio 14 but in all honesty I'm really nervous about putting it on my system. I have paying customers and I can't risk the potential of taking down my system...so I wait. I'm actually trying to put together an older computer JUST for installing Studio 14 on. How pitiful is that? I'm just not willing to take the risk at the moment. I'm going to have to wait until it's been out for a while longer before it goes on my "real" system.

Re: poor quality menus

fre31229 — Mon, 16 Nov 2009 18:46:15 GMT

I completely agree. I think it is a shame that Pinnacle skipped the menu fixes in S10, S11 & S12 as if it didn't matter. This is the first impression of your project to your clients.

I think all deserve a much better discount to upgrade to S14. I started with S9 and have not upgraded to S14 because I wasn't sure if they fixed the menu problem yet. Or if there are other identified problems, Pinnacle would not solve those problems too until S17 Plus.

Re: poor quality menus

bsn321 — Mon, 16 Nov 2009 18:20:37 GMT

I echo the thoughts from justaviking: Nick - thank you very much for your prompt reply, responding to my private message, and providing this highly sought information!

With that, I want to pre-emptively state that the following diatribe is not directed at any individual (namely Nick!):

I JUST purchased S12. You've got to be kidding me!?!

I bought Studio to make DVDs - including menus. I'm not even seeking high-end functionality or fancy features - just simple slideshows or videos with a simple navigation menu. I spent my hard-earned money on something that I thought would provide this BASIC functionality. Now, if I understand correctly - it's completely useless?!?

I would not even mind if there was a workaround. Although severely annoying, at this point I would be happy if I could tolerate some way to trick the system and have it render a menu that was even remotely acceptable. But as far as I can tell - there isn't!

This is unacceptable to me. I hardly think I'm being unreasonable to ask for such BASIC functionality in the software I just purchased.

It's like purchasing a word processor application, only to find out that the ONLY way it will display or print the vowels is severely fuzzy and pixelated - and there is NO workaround. What good is it?? The program would essentially be worthless.

How is this different than my purchase of S12?

I would be happy to return my copy of S12 PLUS for a copy of S14 PLUS. Given the circumstances - I don't think this would be an unreasonable request.

I do want to reiterate - this is not directed at the "messenger", Nick. Thanks again for helping to provide the information we have been so desparately seeking.

Re: poor quality menus

justaviking — Fri, 13 Nov 2009 19:12:37 GMT

glus:

The problem as reported in the opening post here, was reproduced here in QA during the S14 test cycle. Fixes were made, and menu quality is much improved in Studio 14 - menu background image and menu text is sharper, the fuzziness problem is improved overall (we also used S9 quality as the benchmark).

Nick,

Thank you for the excellent response.

It (the fix) is 3 versions late. It should have been addressed in a patch for S10. But I am glad that Pinnacle has FINALLY acknowledged that there was indeed a problem in S10, S11, and S12, and that S9 had been doing it right. It's tragic that it took this long.

Thanks again for posting your reply.