Recently I have been noticing that there are no more employees entering in this forum as well as other forum (Raff_Uy and others). Are they still working with either Pinnacle and/or Corel or has all the pesonel been terminated?

Will anyone from Corel enter this forums or will this forum get to vanish in the near future?

R_Vera:

Recently I have been noticing that there are no more employees entering in this forum as well as other forum (Raff_Uy and others). Are they still working with either Pinnacle and/or Corel or has all the pesonel been terminated?

Will anyone from Corel enter this forums or will this forum get to vanish in the near future?

Corel's VideoStudio Forum is a User to User only Forum without any Corel Emloyee support. Don't expect much, if any, future  Forum support here.

The Pinnacle Product Development Team who occassionaly Post, are probably engaged full-time on S16's alledged "comprehensive" Patch Update.

I see that Terri Morgan and Chris Demiris have jointly formed Luma Touch and have licenced the Pinnacle Studio for ipad technology. They will be providing for its development, marketing and support.

What that means for the ipad forum here I have no idea.

Perhaps someone should tell the iPad people there is a forum? I admire your detective skills David.

David Hunt:

I see that Terri Morgan and Chris Demiris have jointly formed Luma Touch and have licenced the Pinnacle Studio for ipad technology. They will be providing for its development, marketing and support.

What that means for the ipad forum here I have no idea.

good find -- where did you see this ??

For a while I've been intending to write more about the uneconomic dynamic of apps created by large companies.

When the Avid app was first introduced I posted about how an app like that inevitably consumes a lot of resources. App consumers are accustomed to frequent updates, continuous development, and quick and personal interaction with developers -- all while expecting to pay next to nothing for the app.

The Avid app never made sense EXCEPT if it was to be used to draw in new users of the primary editing software -- as an indirect form of advertising.

It never really got used that way. 

But Avid was already starving AS/PS of attention and resources -- so it made NO sense for them to steal what little was available for a cheaply sold app.

Apps in general are best created and supported by "out of their garage" developers -- small personal operations that can devote the attention and time to keep their users happy while not themselves having the giant costs and overhead that big companies carry, and which small app profits can't support.

The alternative path is for an app to be owned and supported by a big company -- ie an institution with an agenda greater than just the app itself.

This was the message I vainly tried to communicate when I attempted to get Avid/Pinnacle staff to seek out an acquisition instead by Microsoft or Google -- as for any of them Pinnacle ($17 million ??)  would not have cost anything, but the featured app could have been used to promote their OS and excite users about their OSes potential. This was ESPECIALLY true for M$, which desperately wants and needs exciting unique apps for its Win 8 OSes -- especially its phone, RT, and Metro OSes.

And neither OS has a video app comparable to Pinnacle.  

Sadly, they were all too smart to listen to BARYE. 

Instead Pinnacle went to a company (Corel) already with a roster of video editing applications -- where Pinnacle would inevitably be neglected and eventually (likely) lost.

If there's any hope found in your post, its that maybe a small group of developers can now provide the personal attention that makes some apps succeed and proper.

 

added:

extensively edited for clarity

 

jjn:

Perhaps someone should tell the iPad people there is a forum? I admire your detective skills David.

just saw your forum link 

 

Well, do we all now move to the Luma Touch forum???

Skanter

It seems the wise thing to do as that is where the app is now based and where all the news and support is going to come from.  IMO support on the Pinnacle forum will lapse.

Barye

Not difficult. Opened the weekly linkedin update and it sort of leapt at me. Looked a bit further but not to the Luma Touch site as Jeff did.

Yes, it seems the good news is that the app will continued to be developed and supported by the two Luma Touch people. You'd think someone from Pinnacle/ Corel would have mentioned this here.

I now declare this forum deceased, and new life over at the Luma Touch forum!

http://www.forums.luma-touch.com/ 

 

 

yes, badly handled and candidly,  "odd".

But its mostly consistent with how I've anticipated things would play out following Corel's takeover.

I'm just happy at least for the original app developers -- they somehow managed to get the rights to their app from Corel for a price that makes the deal viable  -- kudos to them.

If only for my own edification and amusement I'd love to hear from all those who last summer pointed to this app in particular as the golden jewel that made the Pinnacle acquisition "worthwhile" to Corel -- that it was the singular piece that neither Corel or any other major company aside from Apple, had.

And while they're at it, I'd love to again hear how the Corel acquisition would protect and preserve Pinnacle's jobs, while revitalizing and resurrecting Pinnacle's NLE products...

  

  

 

Where are all the Corel Employees?

HERE 

immediately after the takeover was announced last summer,  when I was pleading for Pinnacle staffers to seek out a deal instead from Google or Microsoft before the Corel deal closed, I simultaneously wanted to urge those staffers to consider mounting a labor strike, in order to pressure Avid to talk to more potential buyers -- buyers far more likely to preserve jobs and product lines -- buyers potentially more likely to pay more for Pinnacle as well.

I didn't though -- mostly because I doubted Corel would have found a strike to be an obstacle to their objectives, since I think from the beginning they've intended to fire most of Pinnacle's workers and eventually shut Pinnacle down. 

Well I wonder what Daniel meant when he contacted me about Corel keeping PS as below on the 5th July 2012? 

http://forums.pinnaclesys.com/forums/5/541163/ShowThread.aspx

 

Yorkie:

Well I wonder what Daniel meant when he contacted me about Corel keeping PS as below on the 5th July 2012? 

http://forums.pinnaclesys.com/forums/5/541163/ShowThread.aspx

Nothing?

Empty words - Just like Corel's initial Press Release, when they acquired Pinnacle from Avid.

Yorkie:

Well I wonder what Daniel meant when he contacted me about Corel keeping PS as below on the 5th July 2012? 

http://forums.pinnaclesys.com/forums/5/541163/ShowThread.aspx

 

Yes we will!

It's a fantastic product and a strong brand. Please keep an eye out for further Pinnacle software updates from us.

 

Daniel Donovan

PR Specialist EMEA

Corel Uk Limited  

 

A big part of the "science" of PR, in circumstances like this, is to get people to think and do things based on hopes and wishes -- not logical worry and fear. 

The LAST thing either Corel or Avid wanted was for any opposition to rise up against their proposed deal -- from the workers or from us users.   

It helped that the deal apparently was announced and closed quickly, before many could logically process the reality of what was likely to come.

This was a consolidation "merger" -- an event designed to lower headcounts, reduce product lines, and lessen competition.  The fact that the acquirer had the same lines of business, similar products, and overlapping staffs -- made that fact obvious (to anyone with open eyes).

The task of PR is to persuade potential opponents that all is good, and will get better.

PR counts on people being stunned and paralyzed by the announcement, and more importantly, willingly naive in wanting to believe what they want to hear. PR's job is to mollify the various constituencies so that the lambs quietly stay in line on their way to the slaughterhouse...

(in their defense, PR is not in the position of knowing the facts or being part of the decision process -- their job is simply to keep opposition to a deal at a minimum). 

 

 

 Yes, lambs. And don't forget the clapping, barking seals.

 

WeeWee:

 

 Yes, lambs. And don't forget the clapping, barking seals.

Nor the heyenas, vultures and Eeyores.

I was at a UK trade show last week and visited the DVC stand (Peter will know the company) who used to sell systems with both Liquid and Studio installed. A certain Mr Paul Erkhart (Liquid Author) was sporting a "Adobe Guru" badge, but I restricted my enquires to Edius. I asked the salesman if he had any idea what Corel would do, and without knowing my allegiances he said they would be mad to continue with two different programs, and Pinnacle was such a sector leader and sold so much software that Corel would be foolish not keep the brand going.

Notice the use of the word Brand. That might be all they really wanted.

It would be dishonest of me to hide my disappointment with the events of the last few months. You guys don't know the half of it. There is a watershed moment coming up soon - although moderators and beta testers are sworn to secrecy, Corel have announced on Facebook an upcoming update (not just a patch). Once this update has been released then Corel will be free to decide which path to take. Then we can all decide if we want to follow them like sheep or stand on the sidelines pontificating . I'm unlikely to do the former, and promise not to do the later.

 

All kidding and wise cracking aside, it is a sad moment when a company with so many loyal followers let's those people down. I once was one of those people. I expressed my anger and disappointment many times until I realized it was probably futile. It would have been a much better ending if those CEO's would have invested in the product. I'm sure it could have been ironed out as can be seen with other NLE's. If it would have been properly patched on a regular basis many would have gladly spent their money on it including me.

 

WeeWee:

 

All kidding and wise cracking aside, it is a sad moment when a company with so many loyal followers let's those people down. I once was one of those people. I expressed my anger and disappointment many times until I realized it was probably futile. It would have been a much better ending if those CEO's would have invested in the product. I'm sure it could have been ironed out as can be seen with other NLE's. If it would have been properly patched on a regular basis many would have gladly spent their money on it including me.

 

for the record I apportion most of the blame on this catastrophe on Avid's management -- which began by investing about $700 million in buying Pinnacle and related consumer software and hardware products. Then, in only a few short years, through sheer hard work and pure incompetence --was able to convert that $700 million investment into $17 million.

An absolutely heroic level of dysfunction.

Secondarily, Pinnacle's staff has to be accountable for a measure of ineptitude and stupidity for not understanding the clear threat that this consolidation merger represented, specifically to them --- despite my aggressively describing it, and actively pointing to viable alternative white knights.

I would LOVE to learn if there was EVER any contact by anyone -- Avid's management, Avid's investment bankers (assuming they had an investment banker), or Avid's staff -- regarding whether either Google or Microsoft had any interest in buying the Pinnacle NLE product lines.

Avid's price was so low, that it was spare change that either company could have found reaching behind their lobby couch cushions ... 

 

It is the consumer that holds the power in the end. If a company sells something but the consumer does not want it then it does not sell!.

For me the best piece of software that I can use and it does what it says (mostly) is PS12.1 I am not a Hollywood film maker I am just putting my home holiday videos onto a disc for the family to watch but with a little bit of glitz to help the story along. It has direct Smartsound access, it burns bluray and has lots of additions that I have never used but could use.

How many on this forum need any more updates or new software to do what they want at home, do you need to buy anything more? Be truthful!

It seems to me that if PS dies then we won't be buying C***l otherwise we would all be there now using that software, so if C*** l are hoping for us to jump ship I can't see that happening.

In the end I have what I need so in the real world I wont be buying any more software, perhaps on principle, but if I were to buy again, I have a long memory and would look down the street at the other stores. I have myself been where the Pinnacle employees are now and it is not nice, when you are there and the mess is flying you know sooner or later they are not going to want you.

jjn:

WeeWee:

 Yes, lambs. And don't forget the clapping, barking seals.

It would be dishonest of me to hide my disappointment with the events of the last few months. You guys don't know the half of it. There is a watershed moment coming up soon - although moderators and beta testers are sworn to secrecy, Corel have announced on Facebook an upcoming update (not just a patch). Once this update has been released then Corel will be free to decide which path to take. Then we can all decide if we want to follow them like sheep or stand on the sidelines pontificating . I'm unlikely to do the former, and promise not to do the later.

What I've written was based on intelligent conjecture but no independent facts.  

You have access to far more knowledge than me, and yet you're expressing a level of gloom that easily equals mine. In all the the time I've known you I have never seen you say anything with that depth of pessimism and dread.

Not good ... not good ... 

Obviously I'm frustrated and angry that what I had loudly warned everyone about is now happening -- a catastrophe from my point of view.

My hunch is that this forum is likely to be shut as well -- something that on any level makes no sense since it costs next to nothing to run, in as much as the forum is almost entirely devoid of paid staff. (perhaps it will maybe be merged with Corel forums in some limited way ??) 

I'm guessing that the reason PS16 was released was that it was already finished at the time of the acquisition.

Speculating from what limited information I've gleaned, it sure seems as though there will not be any further development of PS16 beyond the already completed update.

What a  nightmare ... 

BARYE:

I'm guessing that the reason PS16 was released was that it was already finished at the time of the acquisition.

Speculating from what limited information I've gleaned, it sure seems as though there will not be any further development of PS16 beyond the already completed update.

What a  nightmare ... 

No software is ever "finished". It certainly wasn't sitting waiting for release to manufacture, if that's what you mean. I see signs that work on S16 continues past the scope of the forthcoming update.

However, after one update, that's when the developers would start work on the next version that they already had a feature list for. If PS (or whatever Corel decide to sell) is to keep up with the competiton, it will need to handle 4K. In order to do that with AVCHD, it's probably going to have to use proxy files until the hardware catches up, as most consumer 4K is the equivalant of 4 streams of full HD AVCHD. It's no good saying "Who is actually going to buy 4K" because the same argument applied to 3D and I can't find an NLE that doesn't handle 3D now. GoPro already have a £300 camera that shoots 4K, albeit at 15fps.

So, which codebase to use? The ex-Ulead codebase or the ex-Pinnacle codebase? That's the watershed I'm talking about. I sincerly hope that they use the Pinnacle codebase because I think PS16 is  - if approached with an open mind and a willingness to question your own workflow - still the best NLE out there, and I've tested nearly all of them over the last month.

I do find it amusing that you think a bunch of highly talented people with transferable skills would listen to a bloke on a forum that thinks he is Napoleon rather than just bite the bullet and get a job elsewhere.

 

Pontificate as per a British English Dictionary: to speak or write and give your opinion about something as if you knew everything about it and as if only your opinion was correct. 

 

Good thing I know everything about everything and my opinion is the only one that really counts otherwise I might be guilty of this.

 

Pontificate?  Is somebody in the running for Pope?

gjslaw:

Pontificate?  Is somebody in the running for Pope?

Yes - Me

.I like the hat