Greetings

Apologies if this has been addressed before but I'm at my wits' end

Camcorder : Panasonic NV-GS300
OS : XP SP3
Pinnacle : Studioplus v9.4.3 (ok it's old but works ok for me!) & moviebox (used in the past to capture from a SONY analogue camcorder)

Video capture via firewire (the only option for this camcorder) was successful at one time but camcorder is now not recognised, neither via the moviebox nor via the dedicated firewire port.

I've tried every possible combination (I can think of) of upgrading & restoring previous versions of the relevant windows s/w, trying different cables etc.

What I have established is that
- another family member's camcorder (a SONY) which is known to work, is also not recognised by my m/c
- both mine and the SONY are recognised by the other family member's VISTA m/c

I now have to resort to the following tedious procedure
- use other family member's VISTA m/c to capture to a .WMV file using MS Moviemaker
- transfer the file to my m/c
- use NERO to convert the .WMV file to MPG2
- use PINNACLE to edit

Extensive surfing of the NET seems to indicate that this is an established and recognised problem, possibly as a result of the upgrade to SP3, but no solution seems to be available (other than a move to VISTA but why should I?).

What is also fairly clear is that the problem is not caused by the PINNACLE s/w.

So why am I posting this if it isn't a PINNACLE problem? As I said at the beginning I'm at my wits' end and I am sure that this issue must have been encountered by a Member of the PINNACLE FORUM community and it is my fervant hope that a solution exists.

Thanks for being so patient in reading this epistle

Baz

 

Extensive surfing of the NET seems to indicate that this is an established and recognised problem, possibly as a result of the upgrade to SP3, but no solution seems to be available (other than a move to VISTA but why should I?).

IMO, there's no reason to have XPSP3 for most of us, apart from "Rolling-Up" SP2 numerous Windows Updates.

Quite a few have "Rolled-Back" to SP2, to resolve issues with SP3, including those on another 3D Video Editing Forum I'm a Member of .

Since I didn't & don't have XP3, I'm nor exactly sure of the process involved in "Rolling -Back". There's a MS KB Article Re: how to.

However, if you Remove XP3 from Windows Updates in ADD/REM PROGS, you'll automatically "Roll-Back" to SP2, but with a warning Pop-Up Message that you'll have to re-apply SP2  Updates (I think). Try that.

In any Event you will have to re-apply SP2 Updates (90 or so?).

I don't have Windows Automatic Updates Enabled, to prevent Installation of Updates I don't want & those which might screw-up my PC. It does & has happenef wit SP1, 2 & 3 over the years, for others on other Forums.

Go to: Start / Control Panel / Windows Icon shield "Security Center / Manage Security Settings for: Automatic Updates / Automatic Updates / Enable "Turn Off Automatic Updates./ OK

Go back to Security Center / Resources / Change the way Security Center alerts me / Untick "Automatic Updates". If you don't do that, every time Windows Starts-up, you'll get a nagging Windows Security Icon in you TaskBar. 

MANUALLY UPDATING WINDOWS UPDATES FOR SP2

Go to: Start / All Progs /  Windows Update.

When you get to Windows Update WebSite, Ignore SP3 Download & keep clickig on Custom etc & In stall all Critical Updates. Then Optional Updates for XP & Hardware.

You need to expand all of the Optional Updates. If you don't want them or don't understand what they are, de-select them.

All will be clear, when you get there. However you do the above at your own risk & I take no responsibilty.

Good luck 

 

Suggestion;

 Before making a major change such as you describe, I would strongly suggest you make an image of your HD using Norton Ghost or Acronis True Image.

This won't help you, but I have SP3 on my XP machine and my fire wire works quite well.

If you make an image, then roll back to SP2, and if it doesn't make any difference, you can quickly restore to SP3.

 Don

cuartetto:

Suggestion;

 Before making a major change such as you describe, I would strongly suggest you make an image of your HD using Norton Ghost or Acronis True Image.

This won't help you, but I have SP3 on my XP machine and my fire wire works quite well.

If you make an image, then roll back to SP2, and if it doesn't make any difference, you can quickly restore to SP3.

 Don

Good point Don

IMO, Acronis would be preferable. I have it & it's easy to use.

Echoing what Don and Color suggests. Let us know how it turns out.

Thanks to all you guys that responded

I do already have the superb ACRONIS - been using it for a while to regularly back up my C drive - so no problem there.

Am a little concerned that cuartetto has a firewire port working under XP SP3 when mine doesn't

Anyway - will give things a whirl when I get time (we retirees are so busy) and will report back

Thanks again

Bazzer133:

Thanks to all you guys that responded

I do already have the superb ACRONIS - been using it for a while to regularly back up my C drive - so no problem there.

Am a little concerned that cuartetto has a firewire port working under XP SP3 when mine doesn't

Anyway - will give things a whirl when I get time (we retirees are so busy) and will report back

Thanks again

One thing I can add to this is that not all firewire chipsets are made equally like that of USB. Some are a bit finicky than the other.

An update

Did usual Acronis drive C full backup and uninstalled XP SP3 only to find that the firewire port was still unrecognisable. Suspect that it may be a hardware problem. Have contacted ABIT technical support asking if there is a way of definitively ascertaining whether the problem is h/w or s/w related. No response yet (ever?).

Then the "fun" started. Tried to restore from the Acronis backup overwriting the SP2 version - machine hung. Successfully restored to an unallocated area but in so doing Acronis inactivated the SP2 OS and as the recovered SP3 OS was beyond the limit for booting the boot routines "couldn't find an operating system". So much for Acronis. Managed, with the help of expert no 1 offspring to eventually recover the SP3 machine.

Looks as though I will have to live with the firewire problem and look further into the use of ACRONIS.

Final question. I have no intention of moving to VISTA but no doubt will be forced to upgrade (to WINDOWS 7 ?) at some time. Will my Studioplus v9.4.3 be compatible with W7?

 Many thanks   

When you did the Acronis backup, did you do a complete backup of your drive including the MBR, as opposed to an incremental backup? Did you save your image to a hard drive, different from your C: drive, preferable not a partition on C?

If there might be another problem, perhaps the Acronis experts can help out again.

As far as I know, ver 9.4.3 will not work on Vista, and probably not on 7.

Don

Bazzer133:

An update

Did usual Acronis drive C full backup and uninstalled XP SP3 only to find that the firewire port was still unrecognisable. Suspect that it may be a hardware problem. Have contacted ABIT technical support asking if there is a way of definitively ascertaining whether the problem is h/w or s/w related. No response yet (ever?).

Then the "fun" started. Tried to restore from the Acronis backup overwriting the SP2 version - machine hung. Successfully restored to an unallocated area but in so doing Acronis inactivated the SP2 OS and as the recovered SP3 OS was beyond the limit for booting the boot routines "couldn't find an operating system". So much for Acronis. Managed, with the help of expert no 1 offspring to eventually recover the SP3 machine.

Looks as though I will have to live with the firewire problem and look further into the use of ACRONIS.

Final question. I have no intention of moving to VISTA but no doubt will be forced to upgrade (to WINDOWS 7 ?) at some time. Will my Studioplus v9.4.3 be compatible with W7?

 Many thanks   

I was under the impression that Acronis had a feature that would let you to boot to a DVD and allow you to restore from there without going through Windows. Maybe something to look into next time around.

I have tried Studio 9 in Windows 7 but could not find a way to make run.

Marc P.:

Bazzer133:

An update

I was under the impression that Acronis had a feature that would let you to boot to a DVD and allow you to restore from there without going through Windows. Maybe something to look into next time around.

I have tried Studio 9 in Windows 7 but could not find a way to make run.

You are correct, for the image restore, you boot from the acronis disk.

Edit

If your computer will boot, you can start at "restore" from within acronis.

 

Don

cuartetto:

Marc P.:

Bazzer133:

An update

I was under the impression that Acronis had a feature that would let you to boot to a DVD and allow you to restore from there without going through Windows. Maybe something to look into next time around.

I have tried Studio 9 in Windows 7 but could not find a way to make run.

You are correct, for the image restore, you boot from the acronis disk.

Edit

If your computer will boot, you can start at "restore" from within acronis.

 

Don

Thanks for confirming that, Don. I knew this was an option, otherwise it wouldn't make much sense if it coudn't.

Hi all

What started out as a hopeful query not really associated with Pinnacle seems to have escalated!!

I am really grateful to all you guys for your input and I think it is now probably time to put this thread to bed.

By way of summary :-

I still have a non-functioning firewire port in XP SP3 and have established that it doesn't work in XP SP2 either. I'm beginning to think that the problem is h/w related and am awaiting a response from ABIT (one can but hope) on how this can be confirmed.

In response to queries on my use of ACRONIS. Yes I used a full backup to an external USB HDD. The recovery process was actioned by booting up from a recovery CD created by the ACRONIS s/w itself (from what I understand, ACRONIS is then loaded into and run from RAM for recovery purposes). I've posted a lengthy detailed description on an ACRONIS forum - I don't think it is really appropriate to post it here - but if anyone is interested in a copy I'm willing to oblige.

It would appear that when I'm eventually forced away from XP, I'll be forced to upgrade Pinnacle. Such is the way of the world.

Once again many thanks to all who have been involved.

Bazzer133:

Hi all

What started out as a hopeful query not really associated with Pinnacle seems to have escalated!!

I am really grateful to all you guys for your input and I think it is now probably time to put this thread to bed.

By way of summary :-

I still have a non-functioning firewire port in XP SP3 and have established that it doesn't work in XP SP2 either. I'm beginning to think that the problem is h/w related and am awaiting a response from ABIT (one can but hope) on how this can be confirmed.

In response to queries on my use of ACRONIS. Yes I used a full backup to an external USB HDD. The recovery process was actioned by booting up from a recovery CD created by the ACRONIS s/w itself (from what I understand, ACRONIS is then loaded into and run from RAM for recovery purposes). I've posted a lengthy detailed description on an ACRONIS forum - I don't think it is really appropriate to post it here - but if anyone is interested in a copy I'm willing to oblige.

It would appear that when I'm eventually forced away from XP, I'll be forced to upgrade Pinnacle. Such is the way of the world.

Once again many thanks to all who have been involved.

We appreciate the update. I hope ABIT can provide you an update about the matter. Is there any chance that you could get a hold of a PCI based Firewire expansion card just to isolate things better?

The old chestnut resurrected - yet a further update and queries!!

Nothing from ABIT (surprise surprise).

Marc. What a splendid idea of yours re a PCI to Firewire expansion card. Why didn't I think of that? It's worth a try.

I've ditched ACRONIS in favour of Terabyte's "Image for Windows" with its plugin using BartPE. It's a sector by sector backup/restore system so hopefully will be more reliable.

One avenue to pursue if I can get round to it, is to backup my m/c, reformat the HD, and reload Win XP from scratch applying all the patches and testing the Firewire port at each stage. This will almost certainly ascertain whether the Firewire problem is h/w or s/w related and if the latter at which stage the failure occurred. Tedious but interesting(?).

No doubt at some stage I'll be dragged screaming into upgrading my m/c and OS to W7 which poses the following questions

1. Unless it has XP compatibility, presumably I'll have to ditch my v9.4.3 in favour of v12 or v14? (Even if W7 does have XP compatibility, the Firewire port may still not work!).

2. If/When I upgrade to v12 or v14 (under W7), will my existing Moviebox Deluxe be compatible? I still have a number of analogue tapes I need to process.

Many thanks

Bazzer133:

No doubt at some stage I'll be dragged screaming into upgrading my m/c and OS to W7 which poses the following questions

1. Unless it has XP compatibility, presumably I'll have to ditch my v9.4.3 in favour of v12 or v14? (Even if W7 does have XP compatibility, the Firewire port may still not work!).

2. If/When I upgrade to v12 or v14 (under W7), will my existing Moviebox Deluxe be compatible? I still have a number of analogue tapes I need to process.

Many thanks

I'd recommend trying Studio 14 when the time comes. I can see it being the easiest Studio version to use so far and is 100% W7 compatible. As per this FAQ your capture device should work fine.

Thanks Marc.

Your help and that of all others who contributed to this string is much appreciated

My "Firewire" technology knowledge is a bit limited. However:

1)  Some Audigy SoundBlaster Audio Cards have a separate "Firewire" Connector as an added feature for Copying Files from an iternal to an external "Firewire" enabled HDD. There have been Posts where these don't always work for Capturing Video.

2) Likewise, some Proprietry "Firewire" Cards, eg; Texas Instruments, aren't good for Capturing Video. Maybe their main function is also for Copying Files to an External HDD..

IMO you're better-off with a separate PCI VIA OHCI Compliant Generic "Firewire" Card.    

My "Firewire" technology knowledge is a bit limited. However:

1)  Some Audigy SoundBlaster Audio Cards have a separate "Firewire" Connector as an added feature for Copying Files from an iternal to an external "Firewire" enabled HDD. There have been Posts where these don't always work for Capturing Video.

2) Likewise, some Proprietry "Firewire" Cards, eg; Texas Instruments aren't good hor Capturing Video. Maybe their main function is also for Copying Files to an External HDD..

IMO you're better-off with a separate PCI VIA  Generic "Firewire" Card.    

colour:

My "Firewire" technology knowledge is a bit limited. However:

1)  Some Audigy SoundBlaster Audio Cards have a separate "Firewire" Connector as an added feature for Copying Files from an iternal to an external "Firewire" enabled HDD. There have been Posts where these don't always work for Capturing Video.

2) Likewise, some Proprietry "Firewire" Cards, eg; Texas Instruments aren't good hor Capturing Video. Maybe their main function is also for Copying Files to an External HDD..

IMO you're better-off with a separate PCI VIA  Generic "Firewire" Card.    

Agreed!

2) Likewise, some Proprietry "Firewire" Cards, eg; Texas Instruments aren't good hor Capturing Video. Maybe their main function is also for Copying Files to an External HDD

If I may be allowed to dissagree on this point.

On the Liquid forum there have been an unknown number of posts from many experienced users saying that PCs using a TI chip for their Firewire cards are the only ones where problems aren't to be expected.

This seems to be true for those users capturing full HD direct from their cameras. LewS and others have suggested that the best way to avoid any capture problems is to use a seperate Firewire card with a TI chip instead of any - even if it's a TI chip - on-board Firewire connection.

wires:

2) Likewise, some Proprietry "Firewire" Cards, eg; Texas Instruments aren't good hor Capturing Video. Maybe their main function is also for Copying Files to an External HDD

If I may be allowed to dissagree on this point.

On the Liquid forum there have been an unknown number of posts from many experienced users saying that PCs using a TI chip for their Firewire cards are the only ones where problems aren't to be expected.

This seems to be true for those users capturing full HD direct from their cameras. LewS and others have suggested that the best way to avoid any capture problems is to use a seperate Firewire card with a TI chip instead of any - even if it's a TI chip - on-board Firewire connection.

Thanks for the SP Gerry. I mentioned TI, because at least 2 anyway, I can think of, didn't work on this side of the fence 

colour:

wires:

2) Likewise, some Proprietry "Firewire" Cards, eg; Texas Instruments aren't good hor Capturing Video. Maybe their main function is also for Copying Files to an External HDD

If I may be allowed to dissagree on this point.

On the Liquid forum there have been an unknown number of posts from many experienced users saying that PCs using a TI chip for their Firewire cards are the only ones where problems aren't to be expected.

This seems to be true for those users capturing full HD direct from their cameras. LewS and others have suggested that the best way to avoid any capture problems is to use a seperate Firewire card with a TI chip instead of any - even if it's a TI chip - on-board Firewire connection.

Thanks for the SP Gerry. I mentioned TI, because at least 2 anyway, I can think of, didn't work on this side of the fence 

I believe I've seen those 2 threads as well.

I'll butt in here just for a moment.  Twice I have had the 'non-recognition of camera/firewire' problem.  Both nearly ended it for me.  The first was a  bug in my motherboard.  Replaced and problem gone.  On another computer that this happened on, I took my video card, firewire and camera to Best Buy to test and they all worked fine.  Went home and it didn't work.  Two weeks and much frustration later, I added a new firewire cable just for fun.  The camera was immediately recognized, and has performed great ever since.  Even though the firewire was tested at Best Buy it was faulty.  So there you go.

Dayjack119:

I'll butt in here just for a moment.  Twice I have had the 'non-recognition of camera/firewire' problem.  Both nearly ended it for me.  The first was a  bug in my motherboard.  Replaced and problem gone.  On another computer that this happened on, I took my video card, firewire and camera to Best Buy to test and they all worked fine.  Went home and it didn't work.  Two weeks and much frustration later, I added a new firewire cable just for fun.  The camera was immediately recognized, and has performed great ever since.  Even though the firewire was tested at Best Buy it was faulty.  So there you go.

Thanks for sharing this with us Dayjack119. It's usually the simple things that we overlook that get the best of us.