THIS WAS POSTED YESTERDAY FROM PINNACLE 

 

Jon RT:

Many users have asked for clarification on SmartSound and its removal from Pinnacle Studio. Here’s our attempt to provide some background and address the questions we have received.

With the introduction of Studio 11, we introduced our Scorefitter music generation software and removed SmartSound (although, through a negotiated arrangement with SmartSound, we allowed existing SmartSound users to continue using legacy SmartSound content by ensuring “backwards compatibility”).  The reason for this strategy was two-fold. 

First, with the introduction of Scorefitter, we embarked on a new music generation approach where we would enable musicians to “score” music for automatic music creation. This approach has allowed us the flexibility to work closely with musicians to author music specifically for the Studio environment. We have signed up great musicians and are open to signing-up new musicians and helping them author content for Scorefitter. In addition, with Pinnacle becoming a part of Avid, new exciting audio technologies have become available to us to consider for an exciting Studio roadmap.  Most of you know the Avid family includes Digidesign, the leader in professional audio production and M-Audio maker of high performance, hardware audio components. Avid is very strong in audio and video and we, along with Studio users, have an exciting audio future. 

 

Second, we made arrangements with SmartSound for “backwards compatibility” in an effort to help migrate existing SmartSound users.  We wanted to ensure that our SmartSound users could continue to use the tools they had come to rely on in previous versions of Studio, with the intention that they would eventually migrate to Scorefitter as a music solution.

 

In terms of Studio 12, we have decided, based on market research and looking ahead to future opportunities, to remove support for SmartSound. This decision was not made lightly but based on a wide range of factors. At SmartSound’s request, and as a result of inability to reach a contractual arrangement satisfactory to both parties, we will be disabling in future releases of Studio current known work-arounds that enabled the use of SmartSound.

 

I HAVE STARTED A NEW THREAD HERE SO THAT ALL CAN SEE WHAT AVID INTEND TO DO. YOU MUST VOICE YOUR CONCERNS BELOW OR FACE THE LOSS OF SMARTSOUND SUPPORT WHICH WILL RENDER YOUR LIBRARY USELESS AS FAR AS THE LATEST VERIONS OF STUDIO OF CONCERNED (UNLESS OF COURSE YOU ARE HAPPY TO USE SONICFIRE PRO)

 

Added: Click here to vote, thanks to DV FX

 

[VOTE HERE] 

 

This is just not acceptable. You are forcing people with large libraries of Smartsound music to go elsewhere. Do you honestly think that we would just throw out our old Smartsound music that in my case has cost several thousand pounds (that's GB pounds) just so that I can enjoy a $100 piece of software no matter how easy it is to use? Of course not. I have been waiting for clarification so that I can decide whether to upgrade our 4 systems to S12 or look elsewhere. I am glad I didn't upgrade, tomorrow the search begins for something as comfortable to use as Studio but with the ability to continue to use Smartsound.

I implore you to reconsider this decision. You are going to lose vast numbers of customers who will feel betrayed by your future actions, heck there may even be a legal case here as the original manual I believe for S12 states that Smartsound is supported, if you then remove that support with a patch would that not be similar to buying a car only for you to come along later and remove the engine during a service?

I can understand why you would wish to develop your own music software, but at the moment it just does not hold a candle to Smartsound.

If Avid were to develop their own codec for compression of film, lets call it the .avid format, would you then remove support for all other file formats?

I am bitterly disappointed by this decision, my company will not be purchasing S12 and neither will our customers unless this decision is reversed.

Yours Sincerely

Ian Litchfield
Sales & Marketing Director
Timeless Moments Limited (UK)

I've been using Studio since Studio 400 but stopped ugrading when 9.4.3 finally gave me a stable editing environment, where I could do what I needed to do without too many system crashes. Workarounds accepted! In almost every production I've made have I used SmartSound. I've bought some Smartsounds discs and I am very satisfied with the music quality! The possibility with Smartsound within Studio was one of the number one reasons why I choose Studio when I was evaluating digital video editing systems for personal use.

I have carefully followed the developing of Studio during 10 and 11 and was thinking that it was time to upgrade both my computer and to Studio 12 when it was released. I felt the product had developed nice! Although I read about Scorefitter and all your misgivings for the future, I never thought Pinnacle would stop the ability to still use Smartsound.

This offcial statement from Pinnacle was NOT what I wanted to read and I must say I am very dissapointed and that it is very unprofessional to remove a widely used function within a version. Imagine Microsoft removing the support for mp3 in next SP for Windows, forcing the users to buy all their music in a new MS format from Microsoft!!

Obviously we don't have all the facts in the case and my guess is that Smartsound also might have to accept responsibility for the decision, since the two parties haven't been able to reach a contract. Regardless the reasons behind all this, it will make me look for other alternatives than Studio in the future! And I feel sad.

Pinnacle/Avid: To this point I have had the thougthts of you as a customer caring company. This decision make me doubt

Thank you all of you that made this issue clear to us.  

Regards

// P-O

That's very bad news!

I hope Pinnacle realizes that there probably is a "silent majority" that feels this same way.

Why did you start a new thread?  We need one voice on this issue and it's here

pinshel:

Why did you start a new thread?  We need one voice on this issue and it's here

Hi Pinshel

I thought I made it clear why I started a new thread, however the first thread was to get an answer out of Pinnacle, that was successful even if it wasn't the answer we wanted to hear. This thread is to make sure that everyone browsing this forum will see immediately that this is no longer a hypothetical issue but is official and going to happen. I am hoping that if we are vociferous enough Pinnacle may have a change of heart. If they don't well then i guess they'll have a change of customer base.

Ian

Keep in mind this only affects new purchasers of S12.  If you purchased a legal copy of Studio that included SS, there's no reason you can't continue to use that version of S#  (and any libraries you purchased) on another (or even same machine), under the terms of the licensing agreement in that version.  And once you have created that clip, you can use it any version, or any other app you wish.

I posted on the other thread concerning Smart Sound but here is a little more of my thought process.

For my part, we, the little people will never be able to sway the big people at the top and very rarely do they change their ways, because it only ever comes down to the £ or the $ (wherever you live!)

I sincerely hope that we can change Avids minds and hope that for once the dollars and pounds don't affect them and that loyalty does. Part of owning Pinnacle software is it's ease of use and Smartsound is a major part of the useage. Take it away and everyone has to relearn the process again, which could lead to people looking at other software if they are going to learn again anyway.

AVID DON'T DO THIS TO LOYAL CUSTOMERS ! PLEASE LISTEN TO US ALL AND RESPOND QUICKLY

A6BN:

Keep in mind this only affects new purchasers of S12.  If you purchased a legal copy of Studio that included SS, there's no reason you can't continue to use that version of S#  (and any libraries you purchased) on another (or even same machine), under the terms of the licensing agreement in that version.  And once you have created that clip, you can use it any version, or any other app you wish.

Except if there is some bug that you really need fixed, which there almost certainly will be, you'll be forced to install a patch that will, in the process, wipe out SmartSound compatibility.

It's a really bad PR move.

B

 

A6BN:

Keep in mind this only affects new purchasers of S12.  If you purchased a legal copy of Studio that included SS, there's no reason you can't continue to use that version of S#  (and any libraries you purchased) on another (or even same machine), under the terms of the licensing agreement in that version.  And once you have created that clip, you can use it any version, or any other app you wish.

I recently purchased a Canon XH A1 and my wife has a Canon HV30 and we are now working with HD so using an earlier version of Studio which we still have (7-11 inc), is not a real option. 

Come on Avid/Pinnacle at least meet us half way and produce a SmartSound Plug-In or even licence a third party to produce one. 

 

Paul W. H

 

Well, Scorefitter may have been introduced in Studio 11 more than a year ago, but only 2 volumes, which only are about maybe 30 songs, have been created since then!  What a joke!  Only 2 volumes to show for all this?  Pinnacle is stickin it to us!

I agree with all above.  Scorefitter stinks - it sounds like crap and there's not a whole lot there, while SmartSound is superb.  Avid is being stupid.  I for one have no intention of installing (read "purchase") any uprgrades that would remove this capability.  Might even be time to look further afield for video editng software.

rstrong:

Well, Scorefitter may have been introduced in Studio 11 more than a year ago, but only 2 volumes, which only are about maybe 30 songs, have been created since then!  What a joke!  Only 2 volumes to show for all this?  Pinnacle is stickin it to us!

I agree, I have scorefitter 1 & 2 but I perfer using Smart Sound because the quality is better and there is more variety. Pinnacle please re-think this move.

A6BN:

Keep in mind this only affects new purchasers of S12.  If you purchased a legal copy of Studio that included SS, there's no reason you can't continue to use that version of S#  (and any libraries you purchased) on another (or even same machine), under the terms of the licensing agreement in that version.  And once you have created that clip, you can use it any version, or any other app you wish.

As I said in the other thread, if you have Sonicfire Pro, all the SmartSound investments should be available for use and import into Studio as .wav files, in spite of lack of support directly from within Studio in future updates.  All other functions such as matching music length to video should be available, plus Sonicfire Pro has many other atributes for use in Studio.

A while ago Smart sound had a sale where the program was free if you simply bought two discunted volumes of SS music.  I am not sure if that sale is still on, but there usually is some good deal available from SS.  Personally I bought Sonicfire Pro 3.0 for $75.00 during a sale a few years ago (upgraded to version 4.5 for $69.00 and received 2 Mood Mapping discs with it last year).  I believe that I saw it as an upgrade for Studio owners for $99.00 at one time recently.  It is worth checking out as Sonicfire is a great program for use with your own, regular CD music as well as SS discs.

Paul W. H:

I recently purchased a Canon XH A1 and my wife has a Canon HV30 and we are now working with HD so using an earlier version of Studio which we still have (7-11 inc), is not a real option. 

Paul W. H

Here's the trick:  You want SS on a 1:31 min clip (for example).  Open a project in your earlier version of Studio, put a blank title on the Timeline of 1:31, and write your desired SS track under that clip.  Now export as an AVI file, but uncheck "include video" and make the extension WAV, and you creat an audio file of your SS, which you can now import to another app.

VE7AXO:

As I said in the other thread, if you have Sonicfire Pro, all the SmartSound investments should be available for use and import into Studio as .wav files, in spite of lack of support directly from within Studio in future updates.  All other functions such as matching music length to video should be available, plus Sonicfire Pro has many other atributes for use in Studio.

A while ago Smart sound had a sale where the program was free if you simply bought two discunted volumes of SS music.  I am not sure if that sale is still on, but there usually is some good deal available from SS.  Personally I bought Sonicfire Pro 3.0 for $75.00 during a sale a few years ago (upgraded to version 4.5 for $69.00 and received 2 Mood Mapping discs with it last year).  I believe that I saw it as an upgrade for Studio owners for $99.00 at one time recently.  It is worth checking out as Sonicfire is a great program for use with your own, regular CD music as well as SS discs.

I was one of those lucky ones getting that free Sonicfire Pro disc Igor, it works very well, I do most of my music adds from outside of my editing program now and as I have 2 machines, I can watch the video at one machine and play the audio on the other to examine what feels right.

The new Sonicfire Pro 5 is going to be released next month if the info is correct and with that program, you have possibilities to really use the background music to go well together with what happens on the screen, at least according to the info given on their website.

Edited later

And, reading more on their website, it seems to be free if you buy any more discs

 " Pricing: FREE with any SmartSound professional music purchase "

Yes, it's true that you can use SonicFire Pro to create your music which you can then export and add to Studio.

The problem with that is:

• First you have to render your video so you can see it in SonicFire (if you want to "score to the video")
• Without a rendered video, you can only edit to a given length in SonicFire
• If you change the duration of the clip, you have to go back to SonicFire, change it, export it, and import the new clip into Studio again
  - This is my biggest complaint... it destroys what today is a beautiful, elegant, and simple, and easy solution

I actually own a couple "multi-track"(?) SmartSound volumes that allow for much greater control (percussion vs. melody vs. background... all controlled individually).  But personally, I would still do the "simple" SmartSound editing in Studio first, and "finish" my project.  Then if I wanted I could do the advanced sound editing as a final step.

I find that I change my clip lengths often while editing.  Often, after adding the music, it will inspire me to shorten or lengthen a clip.  So doing my sound editing outside of Studio will destroy my typical workflow.  What is done seamlessly today will become a pain in the butt.

True, the "workflow" I like will exist with Scorefitter, but it is substandard both in terms of quality and selection.

Maybe I'm not very observant, but did Jon RT (or anyone) ever articulate to our satisfaction what they mean by "next release" in terms of this SmartSound discussion.

Does "next release" include a 12.x patch???   Are we really sure yet?

Dennis

Doesn't

In terms of Studio 12, we have decided, based on market research and looking ahead to future opportunities, to remove support for SmartSound"

answer that?

 

I'm surprised the Jon RT has closed the original thread and allowed Ian's to become the main focus, without adding a reverse link.

 

For newcomers to this thread, there is quite a bit of comment on the closed thread HERE

jjn:

 

I'm surprised the Jon RT has closed the original thread and allowed Ian's to become the main focus, without adding a reverse link.

 

For newcomers to this thread, there is quite a bit of comment on the closed thread HERE

Actually Jon RT did crosslink to this thread in his last post where he says he is closing that thread due to a greater volume of discussion in this one.

If the next Studio patch (not upgrade) actually locks out SS, I wonder if it is possible to have two instances of Studio 12 on one computer with one as is (with SmartSound enabled) and another with whatever bug fix patch comes along (assuming that one would disable SS).  This way you could use the older one to do the SS audio and the newer one for all the editing prior to adding sound.  A bit awkward, but workable.

Actually Jon RT did crosslink to this thread in his last post where he says he is closing that thread due to a greater volume of discussion in this one.

Anyone reading just this thread would not have had any link to what has been said in the earlier thread. What surprised me is that it was the original thread that was locked.

Guys

 Sorry, I didn't cross link back from this thread. I figured since Timeless moments had reposted my statement, this thread had the important info in the first post, so I let this one stand and closed the other.

 You can find it here http://forums.pinnaclesys.com/forums/thread/214586.aspx

Also, by next version, we mean next patch for Studio 12.

Also, by next version, we mean next patch for Studio 12.

Will the SmartSound "Fix" be listed in the List of Fixes?